Losing the back-end in the WET

**Snuff** · 9-17-03, 2:10

I was mucking around the other night on some wet road (always fun eh), just testing out the handling etc...what i found out was just how easy it is to have the back-end let-go.

With a sharp turn one way or another and the throttle neutral or off the car is in definate oversteer situation at about 60km/h. At about 30km/h with a sharp turn I lost the back end completely & had to correct back the other way.

All this is making me wonder how stable the car would be under braking from high speed, and also switching direction in the wet. With such a light-end I imagine things could sometimes get a bit hairy.

Anyone else have these same experiances.

I have stock suspension set-up and tyres about 50%-- fronts a little more worn than the rears. I know this is how the manufacturer sets the car to handle... but I really was surprised at just how easily it would oversteer in the wet.

**KraZe151** · 9-17-03, 3:15

these cars have a major tendency towards understeer, but with some basic suspensioin mods and great tires, you can control it somewhat easily. But in racing or other high speed driving, try to scrub off as much speed as possible before entering a turn. I have Tokico blues with Eibach Sportlines, and Yokohama AVS sport tires, and I have never kicked the back out without doing an E-brake slide. I hope that helps alittle.

-ken

**Snuff** · 9-17-03, 5:41

R U serious??

Sure under-power the car understeers...... but with power-off or neutral I find exactly the opposite.

I could get my car unsettled pretty easy on a wet road just by power-off & yank the wheel!! Wicked

Its so much fun.. but might get me into trouble one day

Thrillhouse · 9-17-03, 7:13

I'd have to wonder if those tires arn't very good in the rain. When I autocrossed the old 6 in the rain I was sliding around corners pretty good, but I never lost total traction. I always was able to just power out of the corners without trouble. All the real racers there with their drag radials were pretty impressed!

Orcus · 9-17-03, 9:23

I was braking from 230km/h to 90km/h with HARD panic braking and sure the car became a little unstable but not to much, it didnt lose the backend anyway

**XsKaPe** · 9-17-03, 11:02

ive had similar experiences.. twice infact...

once i was going up against a 180sx, the road slowly curved and was on an incline, i couldnt keep the car in the lane (i was in the outside doing 150km/ph +) i tapped the brakes and the back end slid out!! scared the life out of me, never expected it to happen in my car!!.. it corrected itself with ease though..

and once i was being foolish in the wet, caught me offgaurd again!

**Blind Freddie** · 9-17-03, 15:58

thise cars for every review that was done were said about:

"power understeer and snap power-off oversteer"

we do have about 75-25% weight biast. i had my 626 balanced in the air with two chassis stands under the front doors, so that should tell you something.

and snap oversteer makes for a bit of more controlled car IF (and only IF) you know what you are doing..... most FWDs understeer and its very hard to get them out of it..... so it gets you in trouble, with RWD you over steere, again hard to get back. with ours just by playing with accelerator pedal you can get it back and go through the corner quick too.

**mx6GT91** · 9-17-03, 22:00

I was going around a 90* turn at about 40mph and i gave it a harsh turn and the rear end got a little crazy. I know its because i gave it a harsh jerk, dont know what i was thinkin but it was kinda fun but gave me butterflies in the stomach

I always hit that turn pretty fast but not like that, ohhh ya it was dry

In the rain i dont even mess around, I have too much wheel spin and no ABS. I always test the brakes before a stop so i know when the lock up. I take it easy when its rainy, even just with wet roads

**Snuff** · 9-18-03, 2:11

Yeah, it is a little crazy to do stuff like that in the wet... but hey atleast you know how it handles under extremes in the dry.

Has anyone with Poly suspension bushes noticed any instability (more instability) when braking hard from high speed??

I read just yesterday that the stock rubber bushes induce a bit of toe-in under brakes which helps keep things under control.

**TiZBaD99** · 9-18-03, 14:30

omfg let me tell you guys a story. the second night that i got my car and this was 2 days after getting my driving license. I completely lost the back end and did a 180 on the other side of the road. Here is what happened. I was bieng a stoooopid idiot and racing my friend in his civic (95 ex, aem cai, hks catback) and we were on a road with only one lane on each side(but the lanes were very wide). on the straight part of the road i managed to overtake him by going on the opposite side of the road, once i was ahad of him i came up to a corner, its about a 60 degree left turn with a hill making the end of the turn about 20 ft higher than before while going about 50ft further. I did not know how to brake so i pressed the clutch in the whole way and floored the brake. By the way i hit the turn at about 70mph. The car did a 180 counter clock wise and i ended up going backward on the other side of the road. I kept going backwards until i hit a snow bank on the curb and a little tree about 3 inches thisck stopped me, the car was just fine but i had to ge pushed out of the snow bank. btw the road wasnt even reall wet there was just snow on the sides that the plowers had push up against the curb.

It was f-in crazy, im so lucky that there was no one on the other side of the road and that i didnt hit one of the many cars that was parked on road on the other side of the road. i could have died and or killed other people.

since this experience i have been a lot more careful while driving, and it helped me to know the limits of the car, in terms of traction.

**shannonlujan** · 9-19-03, 5:15

Yeah, mines done it before, mostly on sweepers under power it just starts creepin out, kinda odd, prolly my crappy tires. Theoretically you just punch the throttle to pull it back in.

**timtx5** · 9-19-03, 6:08

I am another that has been caught off guard.
Coming home one night, going through a round about which the sprinklers had been on one section. Started to plow understeer badly unexpectedly, step off the throttle and the thing started going everywhere.

After facing about 4 different directions trying to regather the thing I managed to keep it together. Someone from work was following and said it was very close to a number of poles.
I have learnt from that one!

At the drags when I removed things like spare tire and tools, the rear is even worse under braking. Especially on a track with a very rough braking area!

**crusty** · 9-19-03, 9:30

If you guys are trying to impress with stories of your inablities to control a car.... it's not working. Front wheel drives power understeer & if you are foolish enough to lift when this happens, then you deserve what you get. To correct understeer, don't lift off, instead reduce your steering angle enough to regain enough control and then steer back into the corner. I know it feels unnatural to turn the wheel away from the direction you want to go, but if you don't you either slide straight on thru the corner or lift a back the car thru the corner. These are basic driving skills, if you can't drive well, don't drive fast or just leave it for the 1/4 mile where you don't have to contend with those pesky corners.

Quote:

I did not know how to brake so i pressed the clutch in the whole way and floored the brake. By the way i hit the turn at about 70mph.

If you didn't know "how" to brake, WTF were you doing on the road endangering lives? Seriously WTF were you doing?

Not having the basic knowledge of car control is a good reason to leave your car safely in the driveway & take your BMX.

Who else wants to post about how they can't control a car?

**shannonlujan** · 9-19-03, 19:47

Quote:

Originally posted by crusty

Who else wants to post about how they can't control a car?

Owned.

**crusty** · 9-19-03, 22:13

I didn't mean to come off too much like an arsehole but it [shizzle]s me when you read the words "unexpected" & " understeer" in the same sentence. My wife & baby drive around & to think there's people out there that don't know basics, who are putting my (and others) family at risk because of that, makes me want to take a big knowledge stick and apply it squarely to their forehead.
The lack of commen sense still amazes me sometimes, these guys must have someone following them round all day reminding them to breath in....breath out.......