someone is working on a bigger big brake kit

**Dutch** · 11-17-07, 15:07

today i had the oppertunity to have a look at some EVO VIII calipers front and rear.
and guess what.. they lign up perfectly with our hubs... at least the fronts do.
unfortunatly i didnt have a rear hub available to check the rear (which is currently most important to me since i have allready Wilwoods at front)
here are some pics.

what do u guys think????

**chief tool** · 11-17-07, 17:38

How good is that.....!

Did you have a chance to bolt the whole lot inside one of you wheels to see what the caliper /wheel clearance is like?

**mxdriver** · 11-17-07, 18:41

interesting...i'll be watching this. the problem w/the rears is that the wb is part of the rotor.

defiler · 11-17-07, 18:59

Quote:

(which is currently most important to me since i have allready Wilwoods at front)

Why dont you have the rear Wilwoods also?

**chief tool** · 11-17-07, 19:18

I just did a bit of research on one of the EVO forums here in Oz...
The brembos are a pretty popular part, and the asking price is $1200 and up.

But there are a couple of guys who seem to think that the 3000GT 4 pot is similar...but I dont know how true that is, but it'd be worth investigating as they dont seem to fetch the same premium price...only $400. Its probably because they dont fit without some impossible mod, or everyone would be doing it.

**ls six** · 11-17-07, 19:57

The 1G calipers bolt on between the bracket and rotor like our's right?

How dose the caliper line up with the rotor? If it dosnt line up you'll need to find rotors with the right offset or have them made.

defiler · 11-17-07, 20:02

IIRC the caliper bolts on top of the bracket.

Quote:

How dose the caliper line up with the rotor?

Thats pretty much the main question. IIRC the Evo uses a similar diameter rotor or larger, so if anything you would just need to find a larger set of rotors for the car.

Also, seeing as they are twin-piston calipers, how would they compare with the readily available and cheap Subaru caliper upgrade on the front? (Given tho, that if they work for the rear, that would be a GREAT benefit)

**ls six** · 11-17-07, 20:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by defiler

IIRC the caliper bolts on top of the bracket.

Thats pretty much the main question. IIRC the Evo uses a similar diameter rotor or larger, so if anything you would just need to find a larger set of rotors for the car.

Also, seeing as they are twin-piston calipers, how would they compare with the readily available and cheap Subaru caliper upgrade on the front? (Given tho, that if they work for the rear, that would be a GREAT benefit)

They're 4 piston. I was asking because in the pic the calipers are being displayed on the wrong side of the spindle.

**Dutch** · 11-18-07, 9:55

im in search for a mitsu rotors since those have the same bolt pattern. also nissan rotors have my interest.

**ademan** · 11-18-07, 10:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dutch

im in search for a mitsu rotors since those have the same bolt pattern. also nissan rotors have my interest.

you can use s2000 rotor or the upgraded 12' rotor with 3000gt caliper, prelude rotor, 3000gt vr4 1st gen rotor/2nd gen rotor. but not the 300zx rotor, the hub thing/clearance stick out too far.

**Zach** · 11-18-07, 10:59

Yeah, I'm gonna be bookmarking this

**gavin** · 11-19-07, 2:05

Frank and I were talking about this and getting something like this to fit comes down to 2 categories...getting it to fit and getting it to work.

Getting it to fit?
-what thickness of rotor is the calipers fitted for? Pretty sure it wont be the stock rotor thickness of .8". If not the stock rotor, then what rotor?
-will this new rotor have the same hat backspace as the stock rotors? If not, spacers or a relocation bracket will be needed.
- since this will be a non stock thickness rotor, will it also be a non stock diameter rotor? If so relocation brackets will be necessary.

Getting them to work
- the brembo ears are the same distance as the GD ears on the hub...but using those mounts would limit the diameter of the rotor to pretty much stock sizes. Having more clamping force on stock size rotors will just overheat them, the pads and the fluid faster. Clearly this wont be workable.
-a larger diameter rotor will have an increase in heat sink ability and gain more leverage. A larger heat sink is nice but the added leverage will alter the brake bias forward. As the GD already has a very forward biased setup, this will have to be adjusted to reduce line pressure in front, increasing the line pressure in the rear or lower the front bite by adjusting pad compounds.
-what is the volume of the brembo pistons(combined) as compared to the stock piston volume? If larger then the stock master cylinder will have insufficient volume to extend the pistons to their fullest extension. A loss in brake pedal feel and pressure could result yielding larger braking distances.

Thats just off the top of my head. Now some of the "make it work" issues are readily fixable, some arent as obvious.

Gavin

**SABBAi** · 11-19-07, 7:26

The EVO VIII rotors are 320mm. Their original height is 43.5mm, as apposed to the stock GD of 47mm. Disc thickness is 32mm with a minimum thickness of 29.8mm. GD's are orig 24mm, with 22 min @ 264mm diameter.

FC and FD RX7 calipers also use the same 160mm mounting lugs for the caliper.

**STW** · 11-19-07, 7:39

While I like the big brake setup very much, I would really want good balance. While the rears seemingly have little effect, on gravel and ice it's very different. Fronts bite less, so more of the load stays on the rears, making them more effective. A great braking imbalance will mean lesser braking effort when you most critically need it!

It wouldn't be overly difficult to machine a floating disc into the rear bearing assembly, but finding a caliper with mechanical hand brake attachment is. At least in Finland the road code requires a fully mechanical hand brake, so using a secondary hydraulic circuit for rear cylinders won't do. Most of the rear upgrades I've seen are meant for brake systems with a drum in the hub for hand brake.

**fredio54** · 11-19-07, 8:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by gavin

Having more clamping force on stock size rotors will just overheat them, the pads and the fluid faster. Clearly this wont be workable.

naughty gavin :-)

the only thing that can make them heat up faster is stopping faster, stopping from a higher speed, or stopping more weight. these are all limited by tyre grip. being able to squeeze harder just means less effort from the driver to obtain lockup(assuming hydraulic issues are sorted.)

i agree that rotor size (dia or thick) is the main reason to change things. ordinary calipers will perform endlessly better if kept to a reasonable temperature. using larger rotors is the only way to achieve that in any significant sense.

wow, i started writing this post about an hour and a half ago, so two posts squeezed in. not sure how i missed pushing enter.

never the less, they dont affect what i was going to say anyway

fred.

11-17-07, 18:41	#3 (permalink)
mxdriver Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Age: 27 iTrader: (0)	interesting...i'll be watching this. the problem w/the rears is that the wb is part of the rotor.
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11-17-07, 19:57	#6 (permalink)
ls six Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: omaha, NE, USA iTrader: (1)	The 1G calipers bolt on between the bracket and rotor like our's right? How dose the caliper line up with the rotor? If it dosnt line up you'll need to find rotors with the right offset or have them made.
	96 MX-6 full exhaust A/C delete spoiler delete probe wheels and a turbo in the worx. 01 626 brake's98 626 sway bar Altima rear sway bar links.http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2934576 90 pontiac transam. 350 TPI motor new 24# injectors. Rebuilt trans. lots to come.

11-18-07, 10:59	#11 (permalink)
Zach All aboard the B& V& Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Age: 32 iTrader: (8)	Yeah, I'm gonna be bookmarking this
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11-19-07, 7:26	#13 (permalink)
SABBAi Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Melbourne, Australia iTrader: (1)	The EVO VIII rotors are 320mm. Their original height is 43.5mm, as apposed to the stock GD of 47mm. Disc thickness is 32mm with a minimum thickness of 29.8mm. GD's are orig 24mm, with 22 min @ 264mm diameter. FC and FD RX7 calipers also use the same 160mm mounting lugs for the caliper. Last edited by SABBAi : 11-19-07 at 7:28. Reason: more info added
	Teh Telstar can NEVAH lose!

11-19-07, 7:39	#14 (permalink)
STW Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Turku, Finland Age: 32 iTrader: (0)	While I like the big brake setup very much, I would really want good balance. While the rears seemingly have little effect, on gravel and ice it's very different. Fronts bite less, so more of the load stays on the rears, making them more effective. A great braking imbalance will mean lesser braking effort when you most critically need it! It wouldn't be overly difficult to machine a floating disc into the rear bearing assembly, but finding a caliper with mechanical hand brake attachment is. At least in Finland the road code requires a fully mechanical hand brake, so using a secondary hydraulic circuit for rear cylinders won't do. Most of the rear upgrades I've seen are meant for brake systems with a drum in the hub for hand brake.
	626 '88 Wagon, turbo 2.0 DOHC My vBGarage My ride at CarDomain

11-17-07, 17:38	#2 (permalink)
chief tool Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Sydney, Australia Age: 36 iTrader: (2)	How good is that.....! Did you have a chance to bolt the whole lot inside one of you wheels to see what the caliper /wheel clearance is like?

11-17-07, 19:18	#5 (permalink)
chief tool Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Sydney, Australia Age: 36 iTrader: (2)	I just did a bit of research on one of the EVO forums here in Oz... The brembos are a pretty popular part, and the asking price is $1200 and up. But there are a couple of guys who seem to think that the 3000GT 4 pot is similar...but I dont know how true that is, but it'd be worth investigating as they dont seem to fetch the same premium price...only $400. Its probably because they dont fit without some impossible mod, or everyone would be doing it.

11-19-07, 2:05	#12 (permalink)
gavin Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: santa cruz.ca iTrader: (1)	Frank and I were talking about this and getting something like this to fit comes down to 2 categories...getting it to fit and getting it to work. Getting it to fit? -what thickness of rotor is the calipers fitted for? Pretty sure it wont be the stock rotor thickness of .8". If not the stock rotor, then what rotor? -will this new rotor have the same hat backspace as the stock rotors? If not, spacers or a relocation bracket will be needed. - since this will be a non stock thickness rotor, will it also be a non stock diameter rotor? If so relocation brackets will be necessary. Getting them to work - the brembo ears are the same distance as the GD ears on the hub...but using those mounts would limit the diameter of the rotor to pretty much stock sizes. Having more clamping force on stock size rotors will just overheat them, the pads and the fluid faster. Clearly this wont be workable. -a larger diameter rotor will have an increase in heat sink ability and gain more leverage. A larger heat sink is nice but the added leverage will alter the brake bias forward. As the GD already has a very forward biased setup, this will have to be adjusted to reduce line pressure in front, increasing the line pressure in the rear or lower the front bite by adjusting pad compounds. -what is the volume of the brembo pistons(combined) as compared to the stock piston volume? If larger then the stock master cylinder will have insufficient volume to extend the pistons to their fullest extension. A loss in brake pedal feel and pressure could result yielding larger braking distances. Thats just off the top of my head. Now some of the "make it work" issues are readily fixable, some arent as obvious. Gavin