Going top mount

**RbluEMx6** · 8-8-09, 21:30

After my last dyno session a month ago I made 234hp/256tq @ 15 psi with the GT3251b turbo, fe3n cams, and VICS. Last year I made 265/290 @ 15 psi with a 50 trim, feap cam, no VICS.

So I am going to address some issues before my next dyno session. First I am going to get rid of the log manifold and go top mount. I want to help power at higher rpms. With the log manifold and .48 a/r ex housing its choking up top. I am also trying to make more hp than torque and these two issues might help out with that.

Next I am going to going to rebuild the turbo and increase the ex housing to a .63 a/r. Its been leaking oil and the previous owner had a screw from the TB break and chipped up all the blades. It doesn't look bad but I am sure it has some effect.

Last but not least, when I get the manifold made I plan on flipping the turbo around and have the compressor on the passenger side. This would be an effort to shorten up the intercooler piping and eliminate unnecessary bends.

The only issue I see is the oil dipstick would be in the way. If I build it off to the left a bit I would have to relocate the oil return so that I can run the downpipe on that side. Would be nice to have it centered but the compressor housing would be hitting the dipstick.

Here are some pics of everything removed to kind of guesstimate what I could do with the setup. I am open to suggestions. Which way to clock the turbo and where to route the intercooler piping and things like that.

**4cylfun** · 8-8-09, 22:51

While i have an F2T, 230 is what i would VERY happy to have. Just enough to satisfy but enough to probably still be a reliable car. I really like the intercooler/fan setup. Is that a slim fan from Jegs or something?

Also, quite the bitchen FE you have man!

**DarkMx-6** · 8-9-09, 5:24

I don't know that much about turbo's so was your old turbo bigger or the new one is?
thats not cool how you got better cams but less power

**matt89glturbo** · 8-9-09, 10:15

I would almost say that just switching hte a/r to .63 might be enough. however the new design would look much cooler. When I get the turbo on mine, it will be a top mount, the coolant overflow will be relocated and the air filter will be there, I'll rotate the dipstick out of the way.

I like the fan setup as well, very similar to how i'll do mine, I'm still gonna run the 2 fan setup, my big fan will fit by the front tranny mount, and I was gonna put the smaller fan between the rad and i/c. Eventually I want to shroud it all off, but prolly wont be right away...

Good luck

**RbluEMx6** · 8-9-09, 11:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4cylfun

I really like the intercooler/fan setup. Is that a slim fan from Jegs or something?

Its an autozone fan. I got it from my brother for free. It makes fitting the turbo stuff easier.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkMx-6

I don't know that much about turbo's so was your old turbo bigger or the new one is?
thats not cool how you got better cams but less power

The ebay turbo was a 50 trim with a .63 a/r ex housing. The pte gt3251b had a .48 a/r and the compressor wheel is a tad smaller. Plus the exhaust wheel is a tad smaller on the gt32 than the ebay 50 trim.

This might help explain why:

Quote:

Originally Posted by TurboByGarrett

Turbine A/R - Turbine performance is greatly affected by changing the A/R of the housing, as it is used to adjust the flow capacity of the turbine. Using a smaller A/R will increase the exhaust gas velocity into the turbine wheel. This provides increased turbine power at lower engine speeds, resulting in a quicker boost rise. However, a small A/R also causes the flow to enter the wheel more tangentially, which reduces the ultimate flow capacity of the turbine wheel. This will tend to increase exhaust backpressure and hence reduce the engine's ability to "breathe" effectively at high RPM, adversely affecting peak engine power.

Conversely, using a larger A/R will lower exhaust gas velocity, and delay boost rise. The flow in a larger A/R housing enters the wheel in a more radial fashion, increasing the wheel's effective flow capacity, resulting in lower backpressure and better power at higher engine speeds.

Quote:

Originally Posted by matt89glturbo

I'll rotate the dipstick out of the way.

I rotated it, but too much and it will be right under cyl #1 ex port.

**monoxidechild** · 8-9-09, 12:28

looking good man! love the treadstone intercooler.

**zlyricist** · 8-9-09, 12:47

based off your peak numbers, i would assume you were running a stroker

post dyno plot?

a .48 exhaust housing is tiny. with a fe3 i would definitely go bigger. im starting to think my 9cm housing will be too small, which is just over .63 i believe. looking for a hx35 instead of my hy

**RbluEMx6** · 8-9-09, 14:16

No stroker, still square. The first dyno plot is in my dyno thread, I'll put the link for it.

Not only is the .48 a/r too small, the turbine wheel is a stage II. specs are Ind 58mm, Exd 54mm. Ebay turbo measured at Ind 66mm, Exd 56mm

So I'm thinking if I can increase the turbine wheel and a/r for the GT32, put it on a top mount manifold, I would get better numbers.

**RbluEMx6** · 8-9-09, 23:22

I was also thinking about replicating my brother's bp turbo manifold for the FE3. Here's what it looks like:

**4cylfun** · 8-10-09, 0:32

^-------

Looks good. Will the hood clear it if its closed?

**M2cupcar** · 8-10-09, 7:10

RbluE - did you ever tune your IGN map in the higher rpm?

**RbluEMx6** · 8-10-09, 11:20

Somewhat. Its still a conservative ignition curve. Advance is 15 deg most of the way. I know I can run a few more degrees timing but for some reason the wide band was showing me running a lean getting close to 17-20 psi. Kinda odd considering I have 880cc injectors, but I think the problem is the base fuel pressure, its stock. I need to get an afpr and crank it up to 43-50 psi and pull fuel up top and revisit my ignition map.

**M2cupcar** · 8-10-09, 12:41

I still think you need to finish up your tuning, but you can't do that until you've got your wide band working properly. I still think your 50 trim power numbers (torque way higher than hp) is indicative of desperately needed tuning work on the high end. Whether that is just tuning, or the need for some mechanical fixes (fuel pump/regulator?) and then tuning I don't know.

**zlyricist** · 8-10-09, 13:58

do want - that manifold. make me one while your at it haha

for your a/f's, thats definitely not right. whats the max duty cycle you hit on those injectors? 40psi on 880's will support over 450bhp if memory serves me correct. sounds like some tuning is in order, and possible mechanical issues. stock fuel pump and stock fuel regulator?

want to buy my hy35

**RbluEMx6** · 8-10-09, 14:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by M2cupcar

I still think you need to finish up your tuning, but you can't do that until you've got your wide band working properly.

I was pulling the reading off log works, And I had the o2 sensor calibrated the day before. 15 psi and under I maintain a steady 11.7 afr.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zlyricist

do want - that manifold. make me one while your at it haha

That could be arranged. A mini ram that close to being equal length will be good mid to high rpm fun.

Quote:

Originally Posted by zlyricist

for your a/f's, thats definitely not right. whats the max duty cycle you hit on those injectors? stock fuel pump and stock fuel regulator?

It was around 66% at 200 kpa, but up top on my maps I have them around 90-100 for a margin on safety plus some serious retarded timing. Yes stock fuel pump and regulator.