Fe3 Head?

[carcenomy]

Damn you wankels! Damn you to HELL!

[veltpak6]

NO the KIA SPORTAGE HEAD WILL NOT FIT ON F2 OR ANY F-SOHC BLOCK!!!! You WILL have oil draining problems.

[SixSick6]

Still doesn't seem like it would take much to take care of that. Fabricate a backside/underside for the back of the block and the proper holes for the oil to drain from the head. You could attach it to the reverse side of the block by welding then decking the whole thing even. The underside could be drained to the pan. It's a wack idea but perfectly sensible. Look at all the crazy things Honda guys are doing.

[fredio54]

sick, i agree, but i dont think the hassle is worth it just for the deck height and associated rod ratio.

[SixSick6]

Originally Posted by fredio54

sick, i agree, but i dont think the hassle is worth it just for the deck height and associated rod ratio.

Well, that depends. It seriously does. You could end up with and FE3 head on an F2 block and already have yourself stroked bottom end without worrying about changing the crank in the FE with the F2. It honestly wouldn't take much to do except for a little thought and ingenuity. From eyeballing, there is definately room to do so.

The only thing you need the oil drainage for is...oil drainage. If you could manage to get everything squared and oil draining properly then you wouldn't have much of a problem. The only part I can think of that may hinder progress is the oil control valve on the F2 vs placement of the oil control valve in the FE3. If you had an extra F2 bottom end (I do) and an extra Fe3 head (I don't) then all it would take is a little thought, a welding rig, a 12 pack of beer and a pizza.

F2 bottom:


FE3 bottom:


You could probably open up the middle of the F2 bottom end and fill up the rest so that the FE3 middle drainage hole would work:





Then your problem would be the other three spots. #4 may cause a problem but you have to remember that the cast iron on the block isn't doing much and could easily be removed for clearance as need be:



Make the whole thing an adaptor plate, say 2" wide by 2" thick:



And make provisions for oil drainage to the pan:



It's a wonderful idea that won't ever happen.

[fredio54]

the welding rig would need to be an SC HF TIG unit, i priced one here at about 6knz$ which i will afford oneday, but isnt in your average garage. the oil valve placement is probably the same, and the drains could be done without the welder, with just a clever headgasket(maybe?) but i still dont think its worth it. if you were going to do all that, you'd want to add forged pistons (with correct valve reliefs), and also the correct oil pump. so you'd have virtually everything apart anyway. which then comes back to rod ratio/deck height only. it would be nice, but others have done it in the short block, and if done right it would work nicely.

fred.

[SixSick6]

You also have to remember that FE3's aren't readily available in the U.S. Even Kia's are still on the road today. (kinda of a make-due situation)

You run into alot of trouble ordering FE3's from overseas. I have a a friend who ordered an FE3 from an "importer" and got a BPT in return.

Here are pictures of the headgaskets:

[carcenomy]

I agree, it's an entirely feasible theory. But even though FE3s are in short supply (and indeed the Kia's) it wouldn't be rational to alter an F2 to accept the FE3N head...

It's not like there's a massive mountain of FE3 heads around without blocks, so why not just use the entire engine? They usually come as a pair anyway...

[fredio54]

rod ratio. it is border line with an f2 crank in the fe3 block.

and some people like a little more bottom end. kindof like the difference between rb20 and rb25.

fred.

[carcenomy]

*rolls eyes* sounds like a whole lotta work for bugger all gain.

But hey, some people swing that way. Could the FE3 block be altered to give it the extra dimensions of the F2/F2T block? Or would it be easier altering the F2 block to give it FE3 style oil drains?

[veltpak6]

There would be no point in trying to get extra deck height from the FE block, you would have to take a minor hit in r/s ratio if you wanted to 2.2 it which is VERY easy, but again those beautiful dimensions would be gone in doing so. if you did 2.2 the FE then the hit in R/S ratio is really minor and not worth thinking about. i mean aside from casting your OWN head, i dont see why you'd mate FE dohc to F2 block? Also the FE3 block is a bit stiffer by design than the ol F2

[STW]

Just a though; the drain passages on the FE3 head seem to clear the F2 block almost completely, why not just weld small collector pockets on the block, then add external plumbing into the central drain? Sure it makes the engine look a bit frankensteinian construct, but it could work.

[SixSick6]

That's pretty much the same idea.

[STW]

Indeed it is, but using external plumbings the job should be much easier. I first thought about tapping the collector plumbing nipples right into the head and welding the channels shut, but that would be too difficult in the long run

[SixSick6]

The whole thing is difficult to begin with.

It's not like anyone would actually do it but it's nice to throw ideas around. For the longest time people simply said "You can't do it" or "It can't be done". If you have the parts available and feel like doing something just because, it usually ends up something really cool that others never thought of or said couldn't be done. Look at all the Honda owners with mini-me swaps, you think the first guy who thought of doing it heard that it was a good idea?....hell no.