I don't have a problem with Hamiltons penalty - IMO he fully deserved it for his hot-headedness.
I do have a problem with Massa only getting a drive-through after punting Hamilton right to the back of the race though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Davaro
So, 6 points in it. I wonder what will cause Massa to win the title, FIA favoritism or Lewis imploding under pressure? again
5 points actually. The FIA gifted Massa 7th place after hitting Bourdais with an extra 25 seconds, remember?
And regarding Issue 1 - Bourdais was quite a bit in front of Massa as he exited so wouldn't have got a blue light/flag at the end of the pit lane.
I'm not saying that Hamilton's first corner performance was clever, far from it, I actually think that it's arguably one of the dumbest things that he's done so far this year, but what I am saying is that we've seen this thing time and time again where someone goes hot into a corner and other drivers have to go off track to avoid them, but we've never seen penalties for that before, why now? Also like I wrote before, I still don't think it's fair that Hamilton recieved the same penalty as Massa.
Additionally people are now starting to say that Heikki may have been the one who actually pushed Raikkonnen off track, not hamilton. Unfortunately the video's have been removed from youtube, so I can't really comment on whether or not this is true Japanese GP: who’s fault? Formula 1 Blog - BBC Top Gear
I do have a problem with Massa only getting a drive-through after punting Hamilton right to the back of the race though.
Historically, that is the "usual" penalty for "causing an avoidable accident"
Plenty of examples of that. What else could/should they have done?
I bet Hamilton fans would call for a DQ or something JUST because it happened to him...
Regarding who pushed who off, the only thing to take into account was that Hamilton caused the entire thing. Everything was fine until he went straight!
It is a pity the youtube footage is off though, would like to see it again. My opinions are based on what happened on the day and I may have missed something crucial.
Africa - It's like "zoom-zoom-stolen"
Quote:
Originally Posted by whitenoyz
let's say you and i are banging, but you're banging goat on the side. Now imagine goat is also banging adie, and adie comes over at night to get her throat coated. Imagine if I'm also hollowing out Mary in my free time, who is in turn sleeping with Zach.
When you do get a chance to see it look closely without your red specs on.
You'll see that Massa outbraked himself and ran too deep into the right-hander allowing Hamilton to take the normal racing line through the chicane and past him.
Massa then cuts the left-hander with his left wheels over the gravel and right wheels over the rumble strips (IE, totally off the track).
As he comes back on track he hits Hamilton with his right front wheel just in front of the McLaren rear left, spinning him round.
Consider this:
If Hamilton had actually taken out one or both of the Ferraris or demoted Massa to last on the first corner incident I'm sure that the FIA wouldn't have just given him a drive through. He would have quite rightly had a far more serious penalty imposed.
That sort of tactic should have gone when Shumacher retired.
Issue 1 - The Torro Rosso vehicle would have received a blue flag once he exited from the pits. A driver comming down past the pits has right-of-way to a driver exiting the pits. That one is a no-brainer.
formula1.com has released a montage of different angles from the three main incidents >>HERE<< and having watched it i think that in the first incident it was deffinately Kovaliennen that forced Raikkonnen off track NOT Hamilton, the punishment did not fit the crime.
The Massa forcing Hamilton off track incident was a stupid move, but clearly not deliberate, this punishment was very deserved.
The third incident is still quite clearly Massa's fault, he quite obviously turned into Bourdais who had the racing line, I still don't know what Bourdais was supposed to do other than let Massa past - which he shouldn't have to because they were racing for position. Bourdais DEFFINATELY did not deserve this, and it's an absolute travesty that he can't appeal it.
Davaro, not being funny mate but you need to stop drinking whatever it is that you are drinking.
(1st corner incident) I have lost count of the amount of times a driver/s going in too hot has/have forced cars off the road, caused huge pile ups and driven into people not to even get a second look from the stewards. Seems there is a nanny state developing in f1 where the drivers will soon be too scared to even look in each others direction.
Don't even need to comment on massa driving into the side of hamilton.
The Bourdais incident is a total joke or at least I thought it was when I heard about it, the guy was well out of the pit lane and in the corner when Massa decided to play bumper cars. No idea what's going on in the stewards heads here?
I am not a fan of Hamilton before you start. I am a fan of motor sport, which seems to be getting spoit by ridiculous decisions.
How trigger happy are the stewards these days? The seem to be handing out penalties left right and centre.
I think the penalty for Hamilton at T1 was a bit borderline but still fair enough. It was stupid driving that caused chaos. Having said that, I can't ever remember someone getting a penalty without hitting anyone. It did deserve a penalty but plenty have got away with it in the past.
Massa: not a lot to say really. Just a botched attemp to get the place back.
As for Bourdais. When they said that was going to be investigated after the race I thought they were being a bit harsh to Massa. I guess I should have known better. The fact that Bourdais was coming out of the pits makes no difference. The blue flag/light at the end of the pitlane is only a warning that a car is coming down the pit straight. It is not an order to move over like it is when shown on track. Massa's fault IMO albeit not worthy of a penalty. Certainly no penalty for Bourdais.
The FIA need to sort out the penalty system if they're going to continue chucking penalties around. I don't know what they can do but giving drive throughs with no chance of appeal is not a good situation. It's ruining the championship.
I totally agree with people who know about Motor Racing.
Sebastian Bourdais was not guilty of anything at the last race and the FIA are so up Ferrari's butt it's untrue.
I have a friend who is a top MSA ( Motor Sports Association ) Clerk of the Course
and MSA Steward and he said that he would not touch officiating Formula One meetings with a bargepole because of the politics.
He was once told off by the organisers of the BTCC ( British Touring Cars Championship ) for Red Flagging a race when the track was clearly blocked and too dangerous to continue racing. They said he would never clerk one of their meetings again after this, as it spoilt the spectacle for the TV viewers.
The MSA totally exonerated my friend and said that he did the right thing.
Being an MSA licence holder myself, I have seen the politics in Motor Sport first hand and it sucks.
Let's hope Lewis gets the job done today but I will not hold my breath.
He did Paula.... but not before a quick switcheroo between the 2 red cars behind him..
Just so Massa could get another couple of points..
Anywhere in the top 5 and we have a new (deservedly) World champion.
John
"A bus station is where a bus stops; a train station is where a train stops; on my desk I have a work station." Cardomain pageUK626Club UK & Ireland Member of the Year 2004, 2006 and 2007
I hate all the bad mouthing that Joe Public extends to James Allen.
I met him last year when I photographed for Karting Magazine the ' Johnny Herbert Challenge ' Charity Karting Event at the Raceway, Kings Cross, London and he is a thoroughly decent guy with immense knowledge of the sport earnt by many years of experience in various roles within the industry.
Like dear Murray Walker, he makes mistakes but that is part of his charm and I will be saddened if he does not move over to the BBC next year when they cover F1 once again.
They say Martin Brundle will be staying on ( Awesome ) but Mark Blundell and Louise Goodman will not be...Shame about Louise because she is a lovely person and great at her job.
David Coulthard is tipped to replace Blundell.
I can't wait to watch Formula One again without adverts spoiling the action.
Well done to LH this past weekend. Kept cool under the strain and deserved the win.
Still one more race where he can blow it though... wonder what the current odds are?
Oh... BTW - I love being biased in favour of the team I support and presenting my thorough lack of motorsport knowledge...The same could be said of 99% of people posting here... At least I admit it...
Moral hi-ground has never been my forte.
Africa - It's like "zoom-zoom-stolen"
Quote:
Originally Posted by whitenoyz
let's say you and i are banging, but you're banging goat on the side. Now imagine goat is also banging adie, and adie comes over at night to get her throat coated. Imagine if I'm also hollowing out Mary in my free time, who is in turn sleeping with Zach.
I hate all the bad mouthing that Joe Public extends to James Allen.
All the bad-mouthing he gets is well deserved!
Being a nice guy does not make a good commentator.
He is about as impartial as Chappel (Sp?) in an Ashes test.
Africa - It's like "zoom-zoom-stolen"
Quote:
Originally Posted by whitenoyz
let's say you and i are banging, but you're banging goat on the side. Now imagine goat is also banging adie, and adie comes over at night to get her throat coated. Imagine if I'm also hollowing out Mary in my free time, who is in turn sleeping with Zach.
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or Lewis imploding under pressure? again
