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post #811 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-18-05, 22:49
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Only a Ripoff if it's something you can do yourself

Realistically, the prices most shops charge isn't that bad, considering the thousands of dollars in tools they use to do the job, the place all those tools are kept in, and not to mention the years of knowledge most technicians have...

Think of this...When you look at how important transportation is in our daily lives, liken that to your health...without either you'll be a lot worse off, yet doctors make a LOT more than your average automotive technician

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post #812 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-19-05, 9:59
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan
Only a Ripoff if it's something you can do yourself

Realistically, the prices most shops charge isn't that bad, considering the thousands of dollars in tools they use to do the job, the place all those tools are kept in, and not to mention the years of knowledge most technicians have...

Think of this...When you look at how important transportation is in our daily lives, liken that to your health...without either you'll be a lot worse off, yet doctors make a LOT more than your average automotive technician

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WTF, who hacked into Ryan's computer??
I can see both sides. The mechanic does this as a job, not a hobby. So he needs to be paid pretty well for his time, the shop needs to pay their bills to run the place, however, to compare them to doctors... that just aint going to fly. If the doctor screw up, the chances are so much higher that you will have permanant damage or death. If a mechanic screw up, the chances are very very low that you would even get hurt. I think the worse that could happen is you may loose your brakes. But if everything else is functioning, you can downshift, use the ebrake... or just run into another car in front of you. With airbags and safty crumple zones, you may loose your car, but you would have very small chance of loosing your life. Mechanics screwing up is a dailey thing. Mechanics don't go to 7 years of colledge plus.
Anyhow, $1200.00 still seems a little high unless the tranny is rebuilt. If it's a junkyard tranny, I'm guessing $600 for the tranny, 8 hours labor @ $75.00. $600 in labory is way to much since most engien swaps don't cost that much labor.
I've never meet a mechanic that is worth $75.00 an hour. I've never met a mechanic that I would trust to leave my car with alone. The dealer has the right idea, specializing in one make of car. That way they can know the cars better. Problem is they don't, and charge way to much in the meen time. In order to do the job right, you need to care. Mechanics, in general do not care. They do a shizzle azz job, bust other things in the process, then charge you to fix them too. I'll never stop working on my own cars.

Bill, 2003 3.5 SE Altima, Black with black leather, headers, full SS exhaust, lowering springs, adjustable shocks / struts, SCAFII, 20" wheels, SER Tail lights, Dual Halos around headlights, HID headlights and driving lights, Maxima Helical LSD.
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post #813 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-19-05, 13:47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wpendl1
WTF, who hacked into Ryan's computer??
I can see both sides. The mechanic does this as a job, not a hobby. So he needs to be paid pretty well for his time, the shop needs to pay their bills to run the place, however, to compare them to doctors... that just aint going to fly. If the doctor screw up, the chances are so much higher that you will have permanant damage or death. If a mechanic screw up, the chances are very very low that you would even get hurt. I think the worse that could happen is you may loose your brakes. But if everything else is functioning, you can downshift, use the ebrake... or just run into another car in front of you. With airbags and safty crumple zones, you may loose your car, but you would have very small chance of loosing your life.
Very good point.

Quote:
Mechanics screwing up is a dailey thing. Mechanics don't go to 7 years of colledge plus.
The really good ones do.

Quote:
Anyhow, $1200.00 still seems a little high unless the tranny is rebuilt. If it's a junkyard tranny, I'm guessing $600 for the tranny, 8 hours labor @ $75.00. $600 in labory is way to much since most engien swaps don't cost that much labor.
Not that much hourly, most places no...but you bet your ass you'll be getting a bill for 8-10 hours labor...Why? That's what the labor guide says, and that's what most shops base their hourly quotes from.

Quote:
I've never meet a mechanic that is worth $75.00 an hour.
'Cause you haven't found the ones with proper training, and who are actually good at what they do...

I've never met a mechanic that I would trust to leave my car with alone.[/quote]

See above.

Quote:
The dealer has the right idea, specializing in one make of car. That way they can know the cars better. Problem is they don't, and charge way to much in the meen time. In order to do the job right, you need to care. Mechanics, in general do not care. They do a shizzle azz job, bust other things in the process, then charge you to fix them too.
The GOOD mechanics, the ones that won't charge you for their own mistakes are definitely worth that money. They're the ones that are worth that $75 an hour. And the Good mechanics know it and will unabashedly charge that.

Quote:
I'll never stop working on my own cars.
Neither will I, for you and I paying someone else to do it makes no sense

And on a similar subject, the shop I work for charges $79 an hour labor. Steep? Yes, we're one of the higher priced independant shops, but still less than the dealer. And you know what? People gladly pay that, why? Because they trust us. We do the job right the first time, and if we don't we admit it and take care of any mistake. Mine is a very easy job, people know we're legitimate, and won't cheat you and rip you off by doing a bunch of unnecessary things.

Also, imagine if you wanted to do your own starter because you didn't want to pay shop rates. Assuming you had no tools or equipment, you'll have to buy it all for that one job. Even a cheap set of tools is going to be $30, starter at Autozone, $120. Time to do the job...2 hours if you're somewhat inexperienced. Between the frustration, running around getting the part and then shooting blindly at fixing something, don't you thing for that person it's worth it to just pay somebody else $250-300 to get it done, and get it done right, with a warranty, possibly nation wide on parts and labor? Can't get that at AutoZone

Sorry for the rant...I guess working in the field has opened my eyes a bit...I used to think shops were waaay overpriced...but sometimes, there are some jobs even I'd pay somebody else to do, and you know what, in those instances it would be well worth it sometimes

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post #814 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-19-05, 15:02
 
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they wanted $850 for the tranny, $375 labor, and $20 in tranny fluid....lol. now that is a rip off for the tranny, because for a little more you can find a rebuilt one, and they weren't going to warrantee it at all! stupid J&B...

So yesterday my car won't start...just a click...so my starter is dead. I get it over to Pep Boys, because they did my starter maybe 6 months ago. they checked it out and called me today asking why my car was there. they said the starter was fine.
I guess as long as it works, right? it's doing the same thing it was doing right before it went out before. it wouldn't work once, then it would be fine for a week, then it would do it again. eh...
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post #815 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-19-05, 15:35
 
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Are you sure it's not the battery. If there are plates shorting out in your battery, this can show the same problems. Works sometimes, then wont. Do you have power to the rest of the car OK... Radio, lights...
I'm not saying it's not the starter... but the starter can be pulled out and tested at Autozone for free.

Ryan, sounds like your turning into a Nazzi mechanic. The people that go to your shop pay the amount because their rich and don't care about money, and because there is nowhere else around in that area. I've known a couple "good" mechanics. One owned his own shop and spent a lot of time going to confrences and tech trainings to keep his shop mechanics up to date... The problem is, he wasn't working on the vehicles because he spent to much time traveling, learning, and doing the business stuff. So basically he was just a manager with a lot of mechanical knowledge.
Mechanics as a general rule are uneducated. They are there because they can turn a wrench and took a couple Automotive classes in High school. I can see why the dealers charge more, they require their mechanics to read. 4 hours labor means 1 hour reading the shop manual, 2 hours working on the vehicle, and the other hour is their clean up, BS time and 1 of their 20 brakes.

Bill, 2003 3.5 SE Altima, Black with black leather, headers, full SS exhaust, lowering springs, adjustable shocks / struts, SCAFII, 20" wheels, SER Tail lights, Dual Halos around headlights, HID headlights and driving lights, Maxima Helical LSD.
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post #816 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-19-05, 15:38
 
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$375 in labor is not bad. Bring them your own tranny, and redline MT90 fluid.

Bill, 2003 3.5 SE Altima, Black with black leather, headers, full SS exhaust, lowering springs, adjustable shocks / struts, SCAFII, 20" wheels, SER Tail lights, Dual Halos around headlights, HID headlights and driving lights, Maxima Helical LSD.
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post #817 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-20-05, 0:08
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wpendl1
Ryan, sounds like your turning into a Nazzi mechanic. The people that go to your shop pay the amount because their rich and don't care about money, and because there is nowhere else around in that area.
Nazzi...He he, no...I've just had a chance to see first hand what it really takes to make a shop run. And trust me, nobody working there is a terribly wealthy person. Yes, I earn a comfortable wage, as does everybody else, but nothing as exorbitant as ripping people off to make a buttload of money...in fact those types of shops usually don't last long.

As for wealth in the area...Again, you may be surprised. Yes, it is the Avenues, Yes, there is a lot of affluence in the area, and yes, some of our customers are very well off...but our average customer doesnt' make any more money than you and Stephanie do...they have car payments, mortgage, kids, bills just like everybody else, and somtimes have to put off car repairs because of them. As for only shop in the area...There's a very similar station, the Sinclair on South Temple and N Street...only three blocks away...and a place called Slaugh's Auto, on 800 E. and 200 S. Also a shop with a good reputation...We're not the only ones, but we stay constantly busy because of the good reputation Bobby has developed, and a wide customer base, and yes, convience of location.

Quote:
Mechanics as a general rule are uneducated. They are there because they can turn a wrench and took a couple Automotive classes in High school. I can see why the dealers charge more, they require their mechanics to read. 4 hours labor means 1 hour reading the shop manual, 2 hours working on the vehicle, and the other hour is their clean up, BS time and 1 of their 20 brakes.
Bill...Wow...you've got a BAD taste in your mouth for mechanics don't you? I don't blame you one bit...there has been many instances that I know of and have personally been witness to of people being taken by repair shops...it's a pity that they do it, because like many racial stereotypes, it gives everybody a bad name...

As for uneducated, College isn't the only education that can be had. Most good mechanics spend many of their first years doing informal classes, and learning on the job. Much like any other apprentice would...learn on the job while being supervised. This is how most dealership technicians start out.

Now, I'm certainly not advocating that we should all use our friendly neighborhood mechanic...or that all mechanics are good or bad...but as somebody working in the automotive field, I just happen to have a unique view on how things are.

Wow...I wish I couldn't type fast...I'd have such shorter posts

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post #818 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-20-05, 0:11
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MmmKay...I'll shut up now...

But Super Stiff Filled mounts KICK ASS!! No more wheel hop...Now instead of the motor trying to hop out, she just lays rubber...great stinky 225/40/18" Rubber!!!

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post #819 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-20-05, 0:50
 
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Ryan, did you do the Home Depot Motor Mount fill or get actual inserts? I need to do that, I might Friday before the event this weekend. I have quite a few things I need to find the time for. Tomorrow I am going down to Scipio area to help a friend remove the turbo setup (manifold, Turbo, ECU, Injectors.. everything) from a Turbo 2.3L T-Bird and he'll be installing on his 2.3L NA Ranger. Looks like a direct bolt-on with the ECU aside from the engine integrity, but since we're taking EVERYTHING, we won't even need to weld up and exhaust (except for past the downpipe). Might be fun, might not ... that's why we have a sawz-all.

I used to work at a Body Shop. Cascade if anyone cares and Body work costs even more than engine/tech. work. If you went to Maaco and paid some idiot who did Bondo in his backyard for a few weeks $80/hr ... I'd be upset. But some of those Journeymen are amazing and have really trained thier hands to do what no amount of reading can do. The secret is to do AS MUCH AS YOU CAN DO YOURSELF, and then all the tiny little complicated things, have them do. It's the same with shops. Yes, I would rather trust an experienced KL-enthusiast than some off the corner Mechanic who doesn't know my car ... but somtimes, lack of tools forces us that direction. When the time comes. I don't mind dropping a few hundred $$ as long as it's warenteed. (ouch .. spelling?)

'02 Ford Mustang- [Procharged @ 8psi][Flowmasters][5-speed][Limo Tint]
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post #820 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-20-05, 9:28
 
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If you haven't filled the mount already, it's too late. It takes about a week for the hard stuff to dry, and longer for the softer black stuff to dry. If you put it in the car before it's dry, you'll be right back to where you were, screwed up mount. I have an extra mount, I just haven't filled it yet. It is ment for my M, but you can borrow it. I even have the tube of poly if you want a hard mount. The tan stuff. $10.00 is the normal price. I buy the poly and fill it, you swap it out and give me your old mount back.

Oh, by the way, I worked in a body shop as a second job for about 6 months. I have full respect for good body work and paint spraying. I would easily lay down good money for a good paint job. It's an art.

Hey, Ryan, sorry to scratch a sore spot. I have had a few bad instances with my 99 Taurus, at the dealer no less, my 2000 boat at the authorized dealer, as well as have herd story after story, after story about mechanics screwing up. Now don't get me wrong, the years of wrench turning in my gargage have shed a little light on the subject of mechanics going in to do a simple taks, then coming back to tell you, oh, you need this, and this, and this... I fully understand the liability factor, shop costs, all that shizzz. You never know until it's too late wiether you have a good mechanic or a bad mechanic. Me, I'll never know. I'm sure the mechanics at your shop are top notch. However, training, and education are diffrent, by a fine line. Agreed, hands on feild training is way better than education.

With that said, I'll stop raging on mechanics. IMO, their like Attorneys. Bad rep, most of them deserve it, there are the few that don't.

I'm throwing my cat back on tonight. Then, soon, I'm going to put the resonator / "cat", after it and have some 2.5" exhaust put in behind that to the muffler. I've revisited the loud exhaust for a dailey driver. It doesn't work to well for old folks like me. Even though it's not very loud, still bothersom.

Bill, 2003 3.5 SE Altima, Black with black leather, headers, full SS exhaust, lowering springs, adjustable shocks / struts, SCAFII, 20" wheels, SER Tail lights, Dual Halos around headlights, HID headlights and driving lights, Maxima Helical LSD.
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post #821 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-20-05, 9:30
 
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Here's a small secret I learned about not having the right tools to do the job. If you don't have it, buy, you'll use it again.

Bill, 2003 3.5 SE Altima, Black with black leather, headers, full SS exhaust, lowering springs, adjustable shocks / struts, SCAFII, 20" wheels, SER Tail lights, Dual Halos around headlights, HID headlights and driving lights, Maxima Helical LSD.
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post #822 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-20-05, 11:51
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wpendl1
Oh, by the way, I worked in a body shop as a second job for about 6 months. I have full respect for good body work and paint spraying. I would easily lay down good money for a good paint job. It's an art.
Agreed! My dad owned a body shop for 20 some odd years, and said it was hard starting off, but once he got a good rep going, he was always busy. He would prolly still be doing it, but he was bought out by a red cross, because they "needed a shop" by the river.

I've got pics laying around here of a triple black paint job he did not to long ago(myabe about 10 years ago,) and let me tell you, you can see the gleam from your teeth in that car a mile away... it's the most beautiful paint job i 've seen in a looooong time. If I was a fan a black, i'd do it to my car, but I don't want black...

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03/05 Spec-V sentra. 03 body, 05 motor. Runs, Just gotta fix something weekly it seems like.
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post #823 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-20-05, 13:28
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Black is beautiful...but a pain in the ass to keep clean sometimes...just ask Sis...She LOVES here black '95 LS and keeps it very clean...but I hear about it

Josh, I did the Home Depot, using 'PL' brand Polyurethane Construction Adhesive, or the Liquid Nails brand poly construction adhesive. It dries VERY hard, and feels MUCH better driving and shifting it. I don't have the front done yet, but wow, what an improvement the rear one was. IIRC, the stuff actually cured pretty quickly...less than a week...though I could be wrong, I kinda just did it and set it off to the side and didn't pay attention to it much until I put it in...

And what a pain in the ass it was!! Fark me those bolts/nuts were on tight!! Especially the one that goes through the mount...Plenty of PB blaster, and a freaking 1/2" impact to get it off...bastard...and then the mount kept getting caught on the firewall and the padding...I don't remember the '93's mount being that big a pain in the ass...

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post #824 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-20-05, 13:53
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan
...
And what a pain in the ass it was!! Fark me those bolts/nuts were on tight!! Especially the one that goes through the mount... ...I don't remember the '93's mount being that big a pain in the ass...

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Ha ha... lol he he... Yeah, those r fun hu. Remember when I was swaping them for $30.00 Well earned money.
It's kind of funny, you can't use swear words on here but this -> @- is OK?? WTF

Yeah, I used to be against black. I've been converted. Black Tahoe, black M edition. Ahhhh, love it. Only with Tan leather. Black leather would be brutal.

Ryan, do you still have a junk hood laying around on an MX6? I was wondering if the front Mazda emblem has holes in the hood behind it? Anyone know for sure?? I want to pull mine off, along with the mx6, v6 and Mazda in the back. And the gold pin stripes. I think I'm going to leave the M edition on the side. Just for giggles.

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post #825 of 12501 (permalink) Old 10-20-05, 14:38
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I have a junk hood...however I don't know if it's got holes or not...I'd imagine it does...but imagination only goes so far in this case

You're welcome to swing by and check some time

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