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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
This motor threw a rod a month ago! (kaBOOM!) ...aren't these pulley marks off? Just wondering if they are off, was it a possible cause or a result of the thrown rod?



 

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one of the cam pulleys has a single mark and the other has more than 1 mark. I cant tell from the picture where they are nor can i verify the crank is @ it's mark since i cant see the lower crank pulley gear notch. Also your blue spark plug wires are blocking view.

But yes it does kinda look like it is off by more than 1 tooth


Edit check this guide that shows the 2 marks i am talking about & also shows the arrows to which they align to

http://bcpoc.ca/TechInfo/2ndgen/leskatimingbelt.pdf


Based on your picture i can faintly see the 2 dimple marks on the R pulley indicating you need to rotate the motor Counter clockwise back to the 2 marks under your spark plug wires. Then see if the U notch of the lower pulley matches it's mark.
 

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Well first off, you have not set the crank to TDC, so you cannot just guess. If its possible to move the crank, set it correctly, i think i can just see the mark at about the 2 o'clock position. Once this is in place, the arrows should point to the area's i have marked in red. If the dots line up with the arrows use them.
Some cam pully's have two dots, or just one dot that is not inline with the arrow, but when the cams are alined correctly, the dots line up directly under the peak of the cam covers (i have shaded them red). Look in to the areas i have shaded red on the pullly's for a dot/circle. Due to the difficulty in being able to see the rear pully marks when the engine is in situ, these dots are used instead of the usual 'R' arrow pointing to where it should be.

 

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
Thanks Boltz and Oddball...I'm not 100% sure I got everything in picture you wanted but these 2 pics are top dead center for the crank gear.


 

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If the crank is definately at TDC in those pictures, then both are out, the right bank more so than the left.

As i mentioned earlier, you will see two dots on the pully's, of which line up with the marks on the rocker cover as shown in the pic below. The Arrow on the pully will be pointing at the right location also.

Its possible these moved when the rod was thrown, anything could have happend.

 

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that R pulley is out by 1-2 teeth or so. the L pulley looks good and if you tried to set it + or - 1 tooth it wouldn't come close to it's marker.

No one can say if it was like this before or after your rod.
 

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Its possible these moved when the rod was thrown, anything could have happend.
I disagree, they shouldnt have moved if you tossed a rod. A thrown rod will just destroy the inside of the motor, it wont cause your belt to jump since the rod has no effect on the camshafts and the even if it were to jam (seize the crank) up some how it would just kill the motor.

1st. How do you know that the motor tossed a rod? Pull the pan off and check?

Those would be out of time if the tensioner was bad, and they are super common to go bad, and when they do.. the motor progressivly just sounds worse and runs worse, and eventually wont run/start at all because its so out of time. Some people might confuse this for a worse problem then it is (actually many people do, they hear the noise and instantly say the motor is junk)

You cant tell if your timeing is correct untill you remove the crank pulley itself. Remove the crank pully via the one large bolt in the center. Reinsert that bolt once the pulley is removed and proceed to crank the motor over to TDC. The arrow on the oil pump housing and notch one the crank gear verifys TDC.
Timeing these motors is very easy to do, but its also very easy to get confused when reading the book.

I have these pics
Front


Rear


Crank (ignore the yellow mark on this pic, thats for puttin on a belt, if yours is correclty timed, the arrow should point in that half moon dip. )
 

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Very good, exactly what that linked PDF said for the marks. You have far better pictures that illustrate the marks 100%.

Maybe he over revved and bent a valve + threw a rod... with what little info from the original post no one knows the "story" of the motor, maybe jamal can give us a run down on what happened. Typically if all you did was spin a bearing + throw a rod likely the cam timing would not change.

When you tear apart the motor take the hydraulic tensioner off and see if you can push the pin in by hand, then next take it to a bench Vice and compress the pin that way. If it is very stiff then likely it was still ok
 

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Yeah I just took them a few weeks ago for a case like this..

The thing about those tensioners is they fail all the time, they might even be solid to a point that you cant push it in by hand or squeeze it in a vice easily, but they are still junk. They need to be at a certain PSI rating to keep a constant pressure on the belt. They are a self adjusting tensioner, as the belt wears they should take up that slack.
I got a stack of them that are junk. Some I had bought (all from mazda) a couple from ebay and some I just accumulated off spare motors. They are very faulty, this is why I have been fabbing manual adjustable tensioners.

Ive spun a rod bearing on my last motor and the timing didnt change. I also dropped a valve on my motor before that, and the timeing didnt change.
A good way to find out if you spun a bearing/tossed a rod is drain the oil and check for shavings.
 

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Are your manual adjusters fabricated 100% solid or is there an internal spring in them?
 

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I can do Either, Without a spring is much easier and cheaper. If someone was looking for something they never had to mess with again, a spring would be the best solution.

otherwise the T-belt cover can be cut away some without any problems for future adjustment (pretty easy)
These belts dont wear out to fast anyway..
 

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The tensioners you are going to sell are they going to be solid style? I know you can do either one i am just curious as to what your main recommendation is.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
I'll see if can't explain a little bit. (for those who are interested)

The engine sounded really good until one fateful day in early December. I revved it pretty high in 2nd gear past 6000 rpm and the motor immediately started making a noise. I don't know car sounds well enough so I can't be real descriptive, but it was fairly loud...it seemed more like a tap tap tap thank a knock but maybe I'm just sound illiterate.

From some reading I had done, thought it might be the timing belt tensioner but it probably was not. I topped off the oil and the sound almost went away...it would stop for a minute or two sometimes but then it would start doing it again.

Anyways, the day she blew (ten days after the initial noises)......I had just changed the oil the night before thinking maybe that might help things. Is it a mistake to allow all of the oil to exit to where it pretty much totally dry with no more drips? Anyways, I did that. Seemed to be running o.k. after changing the oil. It maybe ran less than 5 minutes but it was warm in the shop. This was in the evening.

The next morning the temperature had dropped to where it was very cold outside. It was maybe 15 degrees fahrenheit...I had the car parked outside that morning and took it out for a little test drive. I was keeping the rpms low (under 4000)...the car was warm from the temp gauge but it was still very shortly after it had warmed from the cold.

Anyways, it started to make sort of a funny noise...don't recall what it was now...so I figured I better turn around. About sixty seconds after that noise, all of a sudden the motor went BOOOOM. Was almost like I hit another car...seems like a shock wave went through the car anyways. And that's how she bit the dust, basically. The #6 rod (think that's correct) blasted through the oil pan in a big way and came to a stop halfway through the exhaust.

I've pulled the motor and the crank still won't turn worth a darn. I can only turn the crank with about 90 foot pounds of torque.

 

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Well, regardless then the motor is shot. Figuring out if the timing is off is not really important now.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Well, I did say at the very beginnning of the thread that the motor was blown.

I was just asking to maybe learn something. Thanks, though, for taking the time to look at it.
 

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Well, regardless then the motor is shot. Figuring out if the timing is off is not really important now.
yeah that motor is junk, wouldnt even bother doing anything with it but scrapin it because you can get a used one for chunk change.

This thread is pretty much pointless since that rod had nothing to do with your timing.
But more of your driving habits most likely
Shit me guys.. the fella states at the begining it threw a rod and would like to know if the timing is out because of the rod or caused the rod to go or had nothing to do with it.

Jamal, if anything, you now know how the pully's should be alligned when doing a belt. And no, its fine to allow the oil to drip for a long time when doing an oil change.

If you intend on getting another engine to drop in, use this one to learn about the engine and how it works.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 · (Edited)
Yeah, thanks Oddball, for me it is a great learning tool. I know most of you guys know mechanics and engines forwards, backwards, and blindfolded but not everyone does. (like me)

I'm sourcing a KLZE right now and might have found one but the guy was going to test the compression of a few of them first before I commit. Plus I'd like to see a pic from under the front valve cover.

Yeah, I did learn some things from this thread. Thanks.

Truth be told, I was rather negligent in caring for my car about 7 or 8 years ago. Water pump went out and it got pretty darn HOT and I should have stopped driving immediately but drove it for maybe 10 minutes or something anyways. That was the beginning of its demise, I would guess.
 
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