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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Unless you are driving a 4cyl mx6, don't bother with VTECS, All VTEC is, A valve and cam timing system for higher gas miliage, the only VTECS that are worthy are NEW preludes and Type R's! Sure they have more STOCK hp, But the torque is alot lower. So in the long run On a Strip a STOCK prelude and Type R will beat a STOCK MX6 V6 but on the street the STOCK Prelude and Type R don't have the Torque, So if you are a really good driver with a STOCK 5spd MX6 you should take them light to light! But once modifications are introduced it is a whole new ball game!




94 LS, 5 spd, B+G sport springs, Tokico struts, Platinum +4 plugs, NGK wires, Vibrant FSTB, Ractive RSTB, K&N filter, 17'' Falken's w/215/45/17 Yokohama Avid H4's, and a Pioneer Sound System.
 

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Your philosophy on VTec aint right... Another thing, i feel as long as the mx6 and the prelude are modded comparably, the MX6 will come out on top. I recently test drove a PGT and a VTec prelude. THey both achieved the same results but the PGT did it with much less effort. The honda had to be reved to hell and back before it would go. Even when the Vtec kicked in, it wasnt very dramatic. The hondas are crap and arent what they are cracked up to be.
 

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You know why i waste my gas on vtecs?
so that way i can show them up, and watch as their friends poke at the driver and make fun of him for not being able to beat a 1988 car in their brand new 2k-2k1 honda civic si piece of crap with vtec engin, thats why!

-meaty
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thats a great point, beat them intill their little John Deere motors crap out on them, VTEC's suck and thats the bottom line!








94 LS, 5 spd, B+G sport suspension, Tokico Struts, Platinum +4 plugs, NGK wires, Vibrant FSTB, Ractive RSTB, K&N filter, 17'' Falken's w/215/45/17 Yokohama Avid H4's, and a pioneer system
 

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sweet6 said:
Unless you are driving a 4cyl mx6, don't bother with VTECS,
I wish I knew where this anti-Honda bias comes from.

What's not impressive about 100HP/L in an economy car (Civic SiR)? A 1.6L motor making almost the same power as our 2.5L V6. A 1.8L Integra GS-R running 1/4-mile and 0-60 times as fast (or faster) than our 2.5L V6 mills. A Type-R Integra, 1.8L mill churning out the same power that Mitsubishi got from turbocharging 2-liters. A 2.0L (same displacement as the 4-banger MX6) making 240HP...more than twice the output of the MX6s 4-cyl. 260HP 3.2L V6s in the Acura TL Type S...

How can these motors not impress you?

All VTEC is, A valve and cam timing system for higher gas miliage,
If you understand the relationship between HP, torque and RPM, you'll realize your statement is erroneous.

One of the hot upgrades for the KL03 is KLZE camshafts...or J-spec FSZE cams for the 4-cyl. Why is this? Could it be because the higher lift, longer duration and increased overlap tend to increase power at high-RPM? Sure it is. Going even more aggressive with Interprep racing cams might give more power yet but with a sacrifice in low-RPM driveability and an engine that idles at 1200RPM.

VTEC allows Honda to give their engines a racing cam profile at high-RPM, giving breathing and power while giving a smooth idle and decent low-RPM driveability on the low-RPM lobes. It's not as advanced as some of the newer variable valve timing schemes coming out now (e.g. BMW) but remember, production-wise, it dates back to the first release of the NSX more than a decade ago. The newer motors with iVTEC are more advanced still.

the only VTECS that are worthy are NEW preludes and Type R's! Sure they have more STOCK hp, But the torque is alot lower.
Their torque is lower not because of VTEC. Their torque is low because traditionally their engines are small. Besides, in the performance car game, torque is only one part of the overall equation which also involves power, weight, gearing etc.

So in the long run On a Strip a STOCK prelude and Type R will beat a STOCK MX6 V6 but on the street the STOCK Prelude and Type R don't have the Torque,
A 2.2L Prelude SH makes 156 ft-lbs of torque...97.5% of the torque of the 2.5L V6.

A good launch by a Type-R Integra driver, with its LSD, will result in the MX6 driver getting his ass handed to him. If you beat a Type-R, the driver wasn't trying or doesn't know how to drive it.
 

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U ARE THE MAN!!! that was one of the best replies i have ever seen. shit, if i had the money i wouldve bought a type R over my 93 ls anytime. honda has some great quality cars that are both suitable for the street and the track. i would know cuz my dad and brother own hondas... great answer mike
 

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Hey i'm not gonna bother arguing with Mike. I won't win. If I had the option of my car right now or a Prelude SR-V, surely I would take the SR-V. But those babies are so rare that it's almost impossible to get your hands on those. It takes less money to tune those things and they respond to aftermarket parts really well. And we all know that there's like 90% more Honda aftermarket stuff than others.
 

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Mike, that was great. I started to type something similar, yet not as factual, this morning, but I got lazy.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Is this not a Mazda Mx6 site? this is for people who love their MX6!, Not HONDA's!!, I may not have the most accurate info on HONDA, but they are still HONDA's!, did you guys forget about that, look in your driveway and remember why you joined this site!

Live in the now people, Honda's are like mosquitos they are everywhere, buzzing arround annoying the hell out of you!


94 LS, 5spd, B+G sport suspension, Tokico struts, Platinum +4 plugs, NGK wires, Vibrant FSTB, Ractive RSTB, 17'' Falken's w/215/45/17 Yokohama Avid H4's, and a pioneer system
 

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Mystere_LS said:
And we all know that there's like 90% more Honda aftermarket stuff than others.
Well, yes and no. There's a lot of cheap crap available for Hondas and Acuras, but the largest decent aftermarket by far would be for the 5.0L Mustang. After that, it goes to DSMs. Most of the Honda stuff is spoilers, badges, gauge faces, intakes, and exhausts.
 

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sweet6 said:
I may not have the most accurate info on HONDA, but they are still HONDA's!
Wow... I don't know much about ______ (insert group title here... whatever is most offensive to you) but I know I hate them!!!!!

sweet6 said:
Live in the now people, Honda's are like mosquitos they are everywhere, buzzing arround annoying the hell out of you!
Do you know why car people hate the people you're referring to? Because they're not driving the cars this thread is about. The V-tec stickers, Type R badges, NOS stickers... They don't have the stuff they're advertising. That's why they're called rice burners. They put stickers on their cars to make them seem faster than they are. That's what rice is in the car world. If you go to a track in your nice-looking, comfortable Mx-6 and you race a real Honda driver, you WILL get your a$$ handed to you.
 

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Just remember that with 2 more cylinders, your HP doesnt even match that of the new ludes. if you want to knock Vtec, mention that it doesnt engage until 4000+ RPM (depending on engine). mention that with only 164 HP you can still keep up with a 200 HP lude.

Look in your mirror, see that guy in the Z06 that wont even look at you, let alone THINK of wasting his gas on you...
 

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sweet6 said:
Is this not a Mazda Mx6 site?
Indeed it is.

this is for people who love their MX6!, Not HONDA's!!, I may not have the most accurate info on HONDA, but they are still HONDA's!, did you guys forget about that, look in your driveway and remember why you joined this site!
The love of one's own car (a 1994 PGT in my case) and the appreciation of another make do not necessarily have to be mutually exclusive. It doesn't bug me a whit that alot of the little Civics out there are poseurs; all stickers and poorly done lowering jobs. When I see a TL Type S, Integra Type R or S2000, I think "Damn, that's a nice car." When I see a stock SiR (Canada), I don't, like some sort of brainwashed automaton instantly turn into a "hater". I appreciate the fact that that 4-seater, with a 1.6L engine could give my 4-cam V6 PGT a good run with a capable driver at the helm and an empty trunk.

Like I said earlier, I don't understand the anti-Honda bias. I suppose people read magazines and go to shows and all they see are Hondas and this is a manifestation of some sort of backlash or revolt... :rolleyes: You just can't argue that their engineers don't have their shit together when it comes to internal combustion piston engines.
 

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agreed again... and if hondas really were crap, theyd be out of business.
 

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I too was once like you guys. I thought the HP numbers for the prelude were great. I thought 200 hp in a prelude would walk the crap outa the 2.5 MX6. But then i drove both of them back to back, and the 2.5 V6 got the job done with much less effort than the prelude. I dont understand why, but fact is, it did. The Probe GT i drove wasnt a nice car either. It was a complete piece of crap. The motor would barely idle when we started it up. The prelude was a 99. It sucked more balls than the 95 p.o.s. Come up with your own explanations, but the prelude sucked.
 

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YZF-R1 said:
I dont understand why, but fact is, it did. The Probe GT i drove wasnt a nice car either. It was a complete piece of crap. The motor would barely idle when we started it up. The prelude was a 99. It sucked more balls than the 95 p.o.s. Come up with your own explanations, but the prelude sucked.
This sounds alot like a co-worker of mine: he sold a 1992 3.1L V6 Z24 and bought a 1997 Probe GT and swore left and right that the Z24 was faster. It felt "faster" because the torque peak came in so much lower (something like 185 ft-lbs at just 3200RPM) and he was accustomed to that "feeling", however fleeting (power in those things peaked at 140Hp at 4800RPM) whereas in the PGT, the motor really only comes alive around 5500RPM, with the torque peaking at around the same RPM as the Z24s power peak.

Perhaps the Prelude is to the PGT what the PGT was to the Z24: you've got to work it harder to get the performance out of it and it seems slower as a result. One theory anyway...
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I am the type of guy who also respects all other car manufacturers, but I am also the type of guy who wants to be a little different from the rest.

You guys are 100% right about your points, but I like the snap your head off feel of pure torque!, and if honda can build a engine with great torque in the same class as our mx6 4 cyl or 6, i will be impressed! I am not talking about 3.2 CL or 3.5 TL, I am talking about the Preludes, Civics, and integras.

I see people who ride along in their civics, integras, and preludes, thinking they are in vipers, and it makes me laugh.

I would like to go to a car show and not see so many of these bandwagon cars.

I am really not trying to bash them, but I am new to this site and I really wanted to see what people thought.

So thank you for your replies and keep them coming!
 

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Dude, Sweet6... How can you say that you respect all car manufacturers, yet type something like "but they're Hondas!"?
 

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well first off Mike is RIGHT!!! Mike is always right. Well, not always Mike, but 99.99% of the time. Hondas are great cars b/c if they weren't we would see more Yugos then Hondas. The fact remains that Hondas are good... not the best imports but still can hold their own with good drivers. My personal favorite is Toyota then Mazda. Toyota for their new Celica GT-S, MR2 Turbo, and of course Supra. Next Mazda with the RX7 TT and mx6 (for styling purposes), and their dedication to the rotary motor.

Rick I agree with you on the 5.0L comment as far as aftermarket parts go. I do not agree with you on the runner up. If you really think that there are more DSM aftermarket parts than Chevy aftermarket parts then we can compare. But i can honestly say I have more choices with a Z28 than a Talon AWD or Eclipse GSX. I know you drive a Talon, and love it, but Chevy gives more in the aftermarket.
 

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Well you guys can speak of Mustangs and z28's.. but don't forget about the Supra TT. Sure they are rare that's why there aren't as many aftermarket stuff for them. But performance wise, those guys have it best. I have alot of videos of different Supras with over 800+ power running against other cars... with a Turbo kit that's about 16K USD. I forgot what the site is called that sells these Supra supplies. But performance wise, I have to go with the Supra TT.
 
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